Justin Moore:

[18 June] 1978, having a session with Bartholomew in Santa Fe, New Mexico. And the first question we would like to ask pertains to the subject of free will, which is one that I know we've all thought about a great deal.

When one says "thy will be done, not my will, but thy will", one wonders how the... how the two operate together best for the work, the higher purpose in life. On the one hand, the desires of the small will are honored by the greater will. And yet, on the other hand, it seems as though the small will does not always understand what is best and what the greater will would like to see done.

So, with this type of a background, we would ask that Bartholomew comment.

Bartholomew / Mary-Margaret Moore:

Well, the whole subject of free will is greatly muddled on the earth plane. There is a great deal of misunderstanding. It's been misused through the ages by all of the great religions. [They] have in one way or another used it to their own ends.

It is very difficult to... Let me say that many people will not understand what I'm about to say. This tape is really not going to appeal to a great many people. So I would ask all of you to bear this in mind and not be surprised at any adverse reactions that you might get from various people.

I am going to speak on free will at the highest level that I feel all of you are able to understand. And therefore there will be many who will fall away and not be able to understand. But I would like to, because I feel that our friends in Socorro, as well as yourself and your wife, will be able to understand what I'm saying.

So with that background, here we begin. The entire subject of free will can only be understood with the background of realizing that the Father allows you to play out any of the fantasies that you create. If it is your desire to create a certain life force and have your life go in certain ways, be assured that there is no divine force that will come in and break that asunder and make you do their will.

It is to be utterly understood that no such action is taken by the Divine. The only time that the Divine will and yours are united in harmony is when you say, I have observed that following my own will, I get into difficulties. I do not like the life that my own separate will has created. Therefore, I turn to you, Father, or the Divine or the great power, however you want to manifest this question, I turn to that great power and ask that my will join with yours in order to fulfill the plan as you, with a greater will, perceive it.

Do you understand? There is no way that... this is why we laugh on our side - it's not very humorous - but nevertheless, it very often happens that... that people on the earth plane tend to think that God is running their life.

And they take great joy in doing very strange and weird and wonderful little fantasies that are totally their own and give God the credit. And this is really not the way it is. It isn't set up this way at all. The truth of the situation is that free will is simply something that happens, no matter how we would... we would wish it to be otherwise.

All right. Now, this is a difficult situation here. No, leave the tape on. All right. The vehicle is experiencing tremendous difficulty. And I will explain what it is.

It is time for the other master of whom we spoke to come in and we will see how it works.

Unidentified Master / Mary-Margaret Moore:

Good afternoon.

Justin Moore:

Good afternoon, Master.

Unidentified Master / Mary-Margaret Moore:

We felt this a... auspicious time for my presence to come into this work.

Justin Moore:

We are grateful.

Unidentified Master / Mary-Margaret Moore:

We will see how well it works and how well the vehicle is able to work with it. It may be necessary to have a movement from one to the other of us in order to facilitate the ease for the physical vehicle of the woman.

I chose to speak about free will at this time on my own because I want both of you to understand certain things in regards to me. I have long been working with you both and with friends of yours to the north of Santa Fe, and I feel that it is now time for us to bring forth a new teaching for this area.

The teaching is very old, but it is new to the area in which you live. And we are asking to the degree to which you are able to please further our cause, if you are willing to do so.

The necessary instruction will be given more and more and more as time goes on in greater detail, in greater depth as the woman is better able to release her last holdings. You see, through all this process, she has had a rounding, a holding because of her fears of being completely taken over.

And this is a healthy sign, and we approve of it. But nevertheless, there will be a time when she will have to release. The power at this stage is so great for her that she will have to begin to release her own situation in order to encompass what we are placing within her.

Do you understand me?

Justin Moore:

I do.

Unidentified Master / Mary-Margaret Moore:

So the next few sessions when I enter may be very difficult for her and may not be terribly meaningful. Because the symbology used is of a different order than what we have been using with my brother.

So we will present a picture to you of free will. Let us envision a vast sphere. Protruding from this vast sphere is a small area of the vastness.

This small protuberance is able to look upon itself and is able to see itself and feels itself a separate protuberance. It feels itself separate from the vastness. Now, the question we would put to you is if there is but one will, there can be no separation between the will of the vastness and the will of the protuberance.

Do you understand? There is but one will that moves throughout all of God's work. There are no two wills. There is not a separate will for each individual plus a vast will.

I realize fully that this is the perception of most people. And indeed, if we were not talking from the highest level, I would agree with the statement that there are two wills and that one's will must join with another.

For example, my brother just spoke in those terms. Do you remember? What he says is absolutely true. I am trying to give you a picture of the stage above that perception because I feel that there are a few of you listening to these tapes who might be able to grasp the reality and make good use of it.

So I will proceed in the hope that this is correct. Again, the vast circle with the protuberancd coming out of it. There is but one will. You can say to me then, why is it that there is such destruction? Why is the world in such chaos? Is this then to be interpreted as the will of the one vastness?

And the answer is, all that you perceive on the physical plane, the destruction, the anger, the hatred, the poisons that permeate are an illusion. There is no will upholding those illusions, sir. There is, I repeat, there is NO will upholding those occurrences.

How can you test this? Very simply. Whatever gives birth rises and falls back again into death of any form is not upheld by the vast will. Anything that changes from moment to moment is not upheld by the vast will. The only things that are upheld by the vast will last eternally.

Do you understand me?

Justin Moore:

Yes, I think I understand.

Unidentified Master / Mary-Margaret Moore:

The illusion is that there is a will acting in opposition to God's will. And this is insanity. There is no possibility of anything being upheld by God that is not eternal. It cannot be done. God moves eternally.

The play on the earth's surface that you see, that you believe to be so real, is false. There is no substance. It is form without substance. There is no eternal substance in any of the things that you perceive on the earth plane.

I realize I am asking you to understand something that is very difficult. All of your senses tell you that what you perceive is substance and is in form and has some type of upliftment, some kind of continuation, at least in some way.

I understand that this is how you perceive it. I am asking you to begin to doubt this. The doubt is the first stage on opening you up to the vast awareness that is yours if you will seek it. The doubt must begin within you: to visualize constantly a world and say within yourself somehow, in some way that I do not yet understand, this is an illusion. What I perceive is an illusion. And I will therefore hold the great doubt within my belly.

Do you understand me? There is a very old tradition in the Zen field that says, with the great doubt embodied in your hara, you will come to know that all is Buddha mind. This is a very true statement, and I ask that we keep it in our hearts and in our minds that what we are asking of all of you who hear this, who can make any sense of it at all, to contain within your being the great doubt.

And the doubt is this: all the great enlightened ones have told the earth beings this world is an illusion. What rises and what falls is an illusion. There is no substance to it. Humans hear this with their ears and they understand it not.

So we ask that you, although you do not understand this at this time, and we are aware that you do not understand it, we ask you to bear the great doubt with us. Will you commit to at least that?

Justin Moore:

I will.

Unidentified Master / Mary-Margaret Moore:

And ask the woman and your friends in Socorro. They need to contain the great doubt. This is the beginning of the vast wisdom. We know you do not understand. We simply ask you to begin the process, and it will work in its own way.

As you look out into the world, you will perceive form after form after form, and it will seem to you to be so utterly real and eternal and strong, because it will have an impact upon you. You will feel it, you see. But the fact is that you are viewing and are participating in a grand illusion.

The mass movement of all the egos on the earth plane have created an illusion. When one incarnates into the world plane, you come in with the understanding that you are creating and participating in an illusion.

Why are you doing this? You are doing this because you wish to see yourselves as separate. This is why everyone on the earth plane is here, except for a few exalted ones who have elected to come back to try and take the rest of you out of your illusion.

You have chosen this world to live in because you enjoy the feeling of being a separate entity. You enjoy this illusion. When you leave body form, you become aware that it is illusory, but you still have the longing, you see. The desire has not left you to become separate, to view yourself as important, separate and special.

This is the human ego's greatest need, is to see itself as separate, special, unique. You see, you come to the earth plane and embark upon this illusion that all of the minds create together on the earth plane, this illusion. You agree to the rules before you come and you play it out.

But there are many of you on the earth plane at this time who are about to state "I no longer wish to participate in the illusion. I see that I do not enjoy and do not feel at one with the illusory world that we have all created. I find it displeasing to my greatest, highest awareness. And so I now select by my own inner will, I say I wish to become aware once again of my connection with vastness".

You see? Do you understand this?

Justin Moore:

I do understand.

Unidentified Master / Mary-Margaret Moore:

Do you think others will understand this?

Justin Moore:

Yes, I do.

Unidentified Master / Mary-Margaret Moore:

All right. I know we will have to deal with it again and again from different perceptions, because although I know... I sense that you understand, there will be many who will not.

And our aim is to make as many understand as we can. The last thing that I will say before returning this over to my brother is be aware that once a human entity decides that the illusion no longer is satisfying, he will seek a way out.

The moment he does that, he is now moving back into the withdrawing as a separate protuberance, back into the vastness of the One. Do you understand that?

And it is this movement back into the vast one that you on the earth plane call the spiritual path. In order to do this, oftentimes it is extremely essential that you have helpers who have returned themselves to the vastness, but retained a small spark of separateness, not from any ego desire, but from an incredible love to serve. And it is they who choose to go back out into a separateness in order to serve you.

These are the great ones that you choose to call the masters. They are great and should be given all due reverence, because the job that they have taken on on behalf of mankind is tremendous, and without their willing participation, it would be extremely difficult for you to withdraw from the illusion and return to the vastness.

This is why we ask that all praise and glory be given to the great ones who come. This is the point and purpose of ritual that blesses the Christ, that blesses the Buddha, that gives homage and alms and thanksgiving to those images, not because the images matter at all, but because of the tremendous service that they do mankind, that mankind is utterly unaware of.

Have I made this understandable?

Justin Moore:

You have. In one tradition, these are called the bodhisattvas?

Unidentified Master / Mary-Margaret Moore:

That is true. The closest word for this is bodhisattva because they have been understood the best. Now, there are bodhisattvas in all religions. There is not a religion... for example, you do not only have bodhisattvas in the Buddhist tradition.

There are many bodhisattvas in the Christian tradition. Great and wondrous beings who choose to love the earth plane. The one that is foremost in the life of the woman speaking is the entity who has been come to [be] known on the earth plane as Saint Francis, he is very much her bodhisattva.

It is this tremendous love that generates in him that has helped her so much on the path without her knowledge of this. Yours, Sir, is a bodhisattva known as Plato. These are bodhisattvas who choose. Therefore...

I feel that the woman... it is best if we return to my brother.

Justin Moore:

Thank you, master.

Unidentified Master / Mary-Margaret Moore:

Before I go, I will give you instruction if you wish to take it.

Justin Moore:

Oh, yes.

Unidentified Master / Mary-Margaret Moore:

When the woman travels north this week, it is important that she receives the mantram of which we spoke. It would be important for you both to begin use of it together at first, aloud. It is important that the sounds are correct, as near correct as possible. Because if the sounds are at their peak of understanding and clarity, then the response will be greater.

I would ask that you begin the process that way. And then, if you would please, work together at the beginning. A dual chanting of the mantram and then meditation into a quiet state. Is that agreeable?

Justin Moore:

Yes. Now, is this Bartholomew speaking or Bartholomew's brother?

Bartholomew / Mary-Margaret Moore:

We've had to move down because she can't hold that much energy at this time. So this is Bartholomew, but he is asking me to translate this down to you.

So... because she cannot yet contain that. Now, as the months go on, she will become more accustomed to the vehicle. There is a great deal of energy empowering that entity speaking, and it is very difficult for her to hold it and not lose total consciousness. So as she becomes more and more aware of it, then it will work for her.

Did you have some questions then, Sir? For the book?

Justin Moore:

Yes, if you feel it's appropriate now... Well, my curveball kind of turned into something else. What I had intended to do originally was to give you a list of items and ask you to select. But if you prefer, I will simply pick one myself.

Bartholomew / Mary-Margaret Moore:

Whatever you feel is appropriate for the moment.

Justin Moore:

Yes, this is very appropriate in my judgment. In a previous tape, you stated - and I was reminded of it through the other master's comments on the free will - you stated with regard to the opening of the gospel according to St. John, which refers to the beginning and the Word and the Word being with God and the light and the darkness, not perceiving the light.

Now, at that time you commented that the Word, which we can understand in terms of the Holy Spirit and the Light, were sent by God in order to bridge the gap that occurred in primordial times between the Godhead and that part of God that chose to experience separateness.

Could you elaborate on the nature of the Word - what that means - the Word and the Light, and their function in closing this gap?

Bartholomew / Mary-Margaret Moore:

Well, the Word can best be understood in your terminology as the Holy Spirit. You see, the Holy Spirit, literally, it... the reason it's called the Word is it literally speaks. See, this is something that people have lost sight of.

They think in terms of words as being things that are written down in books. The truth is that the Word is something that speaks to you. It is audible. It is audible in many people. It's audible to their ears.

Did you know this, that many people on the earth plane really hear the Holy Spirit in an actual voice? But... but often this is rare. The usual case is that it is a Word that resounds within one's being and one that is able to hear it on an inner plane and respond to it.

So the Word is literally the Holy Spirit. Now, the carriers of the Word, or the great messengers of God, are such people as the Christ. Now, Christ was the Word when he walked this earth. He was the Word. He spoke as the Word. He spoke the Word and it manifested through Him.

Is this understood? Now, as far as the reason that the Word was important was that... I think the best analogy to say is that the entities who have chosen to experience themselves as separate are really literally asleep. They have fallen asleep. They are asleep and therefore unaware of the vastness.

And it is an awakening process that must take place. And as words awaken a sleeping child on the earth plane, words can awaken a sleeping soul on the spiritual plane.

And therefore we use this kind of apparatus, this resounding of the Word throughout the being. This is of course, why mantrams are so important. [A] mantram is a resounding of the Word within a being that will awaken, literally bring out of a sleep the entity.

And these are true statements. The Hindus are very wise in their use of mantrams because it does work. The Western world deprecates it because the Western world likes the intricacies of the intellect too much, you see.

It is too simple to say "If I say the same word over and over and over again, this will somehow transform my mind and body". The Westerner doesn't like this approach, you see. They like something much more intellectual. They like something different.

So we have to perform different functions for different people, you see. But the fact is that one of the easiest ways to transform all of your thoughts and your mind and your heart and your body and the actual tissues within your body is to use your mantram.

And this is something that the West will have to wake up to. They're very deprecating. And they also say, well, why should we use an Indian mantram? Well, the reason is very simple. The Indians are the people, the culture that have studied, you see. They have studied and heard the eternal sounds and have put them through years and years and years of great study.

They have selected the sounds and put them into a vocal form and they are very useful. In no way do I agree with the Westerners' opinion on stating that it is an Eastern mantram and therefore has no use in a Western world.

God is one. The vibrations that move through the earth are one. The Christians have not taken the time to do this, do you understand? If the Christians as a whole had taken the same amount of time for the studying of the sounds that they hear and had taken them seriously and tried to put them into some kind of a chant, then I would say by all means, use it.

But the Christians have not done this. So what we have to do is to use what is available. And the old chants that were available to the sages of old are very valid and still hold tremendous power of transformation.

And I would not at all agree with the Western ideas. I'm sorry if I injure anyone who might hear these tapes, but I must speak in this way, that this must be given as credit to the Indian culture for having dedicated so many lifetimes for this study.

Justin Moore:

Then we can infer from this that the Transcendental Meditation movement, which of course, as I understand it, is very profoundly devoted to the use of sound, the power of sound for transformation is doing a very helpful work.

Bartholomew / Mary-Margaret Moore:

Yes, they're helping everyone. Now the trouble with any of these is that once they become cults, then they become dangerous in a sense. You see, this mass movement of looking to... what can I say... the human being takes a very simple thing and makes it very complicated.

This, I feel, is a... is a true statement. If one were to be given a mantram or respond to a mantram and just spend the rest of their life doing that mantram and not mentalize it, not work the mind on it, not try to organize it, not groupify it, not... not organizationize it.

These are making elaborate words here in play, you see, in fun, to try to make you aware that it is this desire to make things into great edifying structures, rising to heaven, that defeats mankind and makes the very simple into the very complex. Much of the Maharishi movement has gone into avenues that are useless.

The whole new movement for levitation, for example, is a total waste of expensive energy. If they would stay with the simple, which is simply to do the mantram and to do it with all due humility - that's a private function - and not move into organizations and so forth.

But nevertheless, that's all I would say on that. But, yes, at the beginning, and if they... to whatever extent that the Maharishi disciples can do mantrams for themselves and for the benefit of all of mankind, they are doing a tremendous help, yes.

Justin Moore:

Would you care to comment any further on the science of sound, or shall we go on to another topic?

Bartholomew / Mary-Margaret Moore:

Well, I feel that the subject of mantram is very important and very misunderstood by many. So why don't we just deal with that at this time and then we'll just end this tape, because this has been quite a day for the woman. I mean, in this session, it's been something for her. She'll have to ponder it.

All right. The science of sound. Let us again think in terms of a central source. And within that source is contained all of the sounds ever created by the Godhead. These sounds radiate and resound one with another.

They move as multitudinous strands of light and sound because sound is light and light is sound, they cannot be separated one from the other. If you were to perceive sound, you would perceive light, you see.

So if you would view an immense coil of incredibly beautiful, uplifting light, and these lights, as they move one amongst the other and intertwine and interweave and move their way throughout the... throughout the spheres of created worlds, worlds without end, over and over worlds. All of this undulating, moving light makes a sound.

There is a sound that goes with it. And it is a very minute expression to say "the sounds of the heavenly spheres". It is a sound far transcending anything that you can possibly imagine. And it is the most uplifting, the most glorious, the most... totally without words.

I cannot speak words that would express to you the experience of being one with even a slight part of this incredible sound movement. That is also a visual experience far surpassed by the greatest... the most beautiful thing you have experienced on the Earth plane pales, pales, incredibly pales before even the slightest glimpse of this intertwined, incredible movement of bands of light and sound. Do you get the picture at all of what I'm saying?

Justin Moore:

Yes. May I ask whether or not the Hindu symbol - and I'm sure I'm going to mispronounce it, sound "Aum" or A U M, Aum. Is this supposed to be representative of that phenomenon that you're describing?

Bartholomew / Mary-Margaret Moore:

What happens is... let us take as the beginning symbol O. M. The beginning symbol is the O. Understood? It is a letter O.And the reason that it is a letter O is that it represents sound as its beginning wholeness. That is the significance of the circle.

It is the beginning wholeness. Before things blundered apart and became myriad forms, they were one. And it is that that we are speaking of now. It is that wholeness.

All right. Now, the sound at its primordial, at its most basic beginning is a sound that sounds to you as O. This is how it sounds: "O". That is the sound: "O". It is a resounding "O". It is a sound that comes. And this is the beginning sound.

This is an absolute pale replica, what we're speaking of. But the importance of that primordial sound is that it... it... is the beginning sound. Now, from it came out many other sounds which represent all of the various mantrams that are given on the earth plane. Do you understand?

It's as if the beginning mother sound is the "O". And springing from it as bands of light would come all of the other mantrams. They all hold within them the basic substance of "O", only it's broken down.

The same idea would be again, if we will, of the prism. The prism of light. The prism of light, in this case the white light, would be the "O" sound. Banding out into the very various colors would be all the other mantrams of power that come from that one source.

Now, what often happens is that people choose to go to the primordial "OM" sound. And this is fine if they choose to do that. There is no objection at all to that kind of thing. If this is what they resound to, this is what they should do. But oftentimes, humans on the earth plane will ignore their own mantram that they are connected with out of an egotistical desire to go back to the OM. Do you understand me?

This is what I'm saying. So many people on the earth plane have within them a mantram. Then they read a book that says to them, well, the primordial silent sound is OM. Therefore, I will disregard what I really feel.

In your case, sir, and your wife's case, the Work now must be with the mantram that we've spoken of. All right? Now, one could say, well, why should I bother with that? Why should anyone bother with that? I'm not saying that you two question it. And in fact, you've been given it because you don't question it, you see, we don't feel you were questioning.

But there are many who will question. And the reason for this is simply that their ego wants them to go back to the primordial. But in many cases, it is a matter of becoming one with one of the rays, one of the bands which will then... the band itself - when you become one with that mantram - its motive, its movement will take you to the OM, you see, to move to the OM on your own at this stage. For most people listening, in fact, for everyone listening to this tape, whoever might hear it.

I cannot really envision anyone hearing this tape who would not... who would be able to return to the OM totally alone, do you see? This is something that usually must have a teacher, a guide to take you into that session on your own. And this is why we say, please begin with that which appeals to your heart, not to your intellect.

Because usually the intellect is of the ego, you see. The mind says, I wish to have the greatest mantram the world has ever known, you see? And once you do this, your motive is incorrect. Now, it is true that there are some on the Earth plane that don't move to OM, and I dare say that most... many people listening to this tape someday will be moved to OM, but it will not be on their own movement. They will start with whatever responds in their heart, and they will move into that.

They will be taken as if by a giant movement of light... will move them into that. And at that stage, it is a very appropriate mantram for them.

But the "Om Mani Padme Um", for example, is a very effective device for millions of people because it is one of the bands of light that takes them back to the white light, you see. These are all ways that we have of doing the purifying... the body cannot take... as the woman found out today... it is extremely difficult to take tremendous power unless you're ready for it.

And to receive the full force of the OM is extremely difficult for many people. So we purify. A mantram is a purification device, nothing else. Purif... it's very simple.

The whole science of sound is very simple. If you would believe, which I hope most of you will believe, that the thoughts that move through your body leave a residue. The sounds that move through your mind leave a residue within you that you have to work with. Then you will understand why mantram is important.

Because every negative thought that moves through your body leaves a residue. I'm not speaking necessarily of a residue in physical sense, although oftentimes illnesses are caused by these residues.

But the first and primary thing that happens is that your mind then has a residue. Every time you entertain... and this is a very interesting phrase, every time you entertain a negative thought... you are entertaining a negative thought you are giving host to! You are being the host, and the negative thought is your guest. And you're entertaining that negative thought.

And it leaves a residue within your mind. And every thought that enters your mind leaves a residue. It is up to you to decide what kind of residue you want within your mind. They will leave a residue. So it is up to you. This is the whole joy of freedom that I would ask everyone who hears this tape to participate in. The freedom of knowing that you have a choice to make here.

And this is the choice that will free you. It is the choice that will free you from everything, because you must... when you come to really believe - very few people believe this - when you come to really believe that you have a choice of what you entertain in your mind and that what you entertain in your mind transforms your body and your mind together, then you will become free. Because you will realize that you have control over the thoughts that you entertain.

You can take a thought in and let it out, or you can harbor it, whichever you wish. If it is a beautiful, uplifting thought, then harbor it by all means. I would encourage you to harbor it to whatever extent you can. To dwell on beautiful, uplifting, high thought. This is not daydreaming. To sit in a chair and to visualize and to think on high and lofty thoughts is not daydreaming.

It is a purification process. It is far better than sitting in front of a television set and absorbing yourself into the thought forms that are being generated that way. There's a great deal more... you see, we are never doing nothing. You know, you are never doing nothing. There's no way for a human being to stop doing things. You are always doing something.

Therefore, we suggest that you be very serious and give thought to what you want to do. You may sit in your room, and to outward appearances, you are absolutely doing nothing. If you are in tune and giving and ruminating upon high and lofty thoughts, please be aware that you are doing a great service to yourself and to all mankind. Each time you entertain and mull over and make one a very lofty thought, even though it's a thought about love of another human being, or whatever your thoughts, if they can be high and lofty, you will be doing a tremendous service.

So be aware that you make these choices daily, hourly, instantly, every moment of your life, you select how you're going to... what you're going to do to your mind and to your body. Are you going to transform them into power for the light, or are you going to transform them into power for the dark?

It's a choice you make. And whatever you choose you're stuck with, literally stuck with, they stick. They adhere to you. It is a matter of adherence. They adhere to your body, into your body and in your mind. They work as one and they adhere.

And so this is a... I think, a very deep lesson. And the reason that the mantram helps is that it places in your mind a very positive residue. It builds a positive light upliftment, a residue of light and glory and gold and beauty, and it changes you. It literally... if you could see from the spheres of light, if you could see what happens to a body that is constantly entertaining lofty mantra thoughts, you will see: there is a transformation.

Now, the problem is, people have always asked this, and I will answer it right now. Can you lose the power that you have generated through mantram? The answer is yes. If you do mantra for six years and spend the next 12 years doing negative thinking, you will have unbalanced all that you've done.

You must not fall into the trap of thinking that something you create will be there forever. Be so grateful that it is not so. Do you realize that if everything you thought was created in your mind forever, you would never be free. You could never be free.

So therefore, we ask you to give all power and energy to only entertaining and being host to the highest thoughts possible. And in so doing, you will get your body and mind into a state where the highest force can enter in a permanent state. Because, you see, a high power cannot lodge for any great length of time in an impure vehicle. It can't do it.

But it can... [it] becomes more and more and more possible as you become lighter and lighter and lighter, you see? And so there's more and more of an aura of light around you each time you do this, and this is tremendously helpful with each... if you could just convince yourself that each thought you think is helping a hundredfold to make the next positive thought possible.

And so on down you see, It's a chain. It's a chain of light. And if you will just each time choose the light, the thought of light instead of the thought of dark, it will increase a hundredfold and then a thousandfold and then a 10,000 fold and then a million fold. You see, it's an increasing, incredibly increasing mechanism because as you are moving into this, the force is moving towards you.

It's a dual action, as we've said so many times. But we must keep this clear. You are not working as a tiny little entity just struggling against a great mass, you see. There's incredible help always moving towards you. The slightest effort brings all this reward. So each time, do not fall under the illusion that because it's just one little thought, it's not going to hurt you.

You see, one little thought is very important because one little thought turned to one beautiful thought makes the next beautiful thought that much closer, that much more available to you. You see? But it also is true in the opposite. One dark thought makes the next dark thought equally available.

You see, the law works and it works for thoughts. Then it is much easier than to have four dark thoughts and then eight dark... dark thoughts, you see, and they soon crowd in on you, and it seems to you that you can't make any headway.

And so the thing to do at that stage, when you feel yourself in these dark modes, as all human beings on the earth plane do find themselves in, the first thing is do not try and fight the total darkness. Just light one candle. By that we mean one light thought. And light it and hold it and keep it as close to you as you can.

Whatever is an appealing light, a thought of light, hold it, hold it in your mind. Hold it as long as you can against all of the dark thoughts that you have allowed to harbor in your mind. That one thought will become two, and then it will become four, and then it will become eight. You see, the thought process reverses itself.

And this is the most expedient device for man to use. When he becomes dark, his thoughts become dark. Do not allow yourself to go from the 2, 4, 8 dark sense, but move rather from the 2, 4, 8 in the light.

Now, a final... thoughts on mantram. Mantram does not appeal to everyone. And there are many people who just don't feel drawn to mantram. And their minds often tell them this. Now, in truth, and again, I hope I don't offend anyone who hears his tape, but in truth, everyone is drawn to mantram because mantram is the way out.

Now, the problem is that maybe the people who do not feel drawn to mantram do not really understand what we mean. They may feel that we are speaking of a ritualistic type, of a device that various Indian teachers have brought to the Western world.

And they have a great repugnance against... against saying all through their day, Hare Krishna, Krishna whatever. They feel that this is not a process. And I would agree with them: mantram on that level is sleep-inducing. You see, that's not the kind of mantram that we're discussing.

So let us... let us then speak about what we mean when we say do a mantra. All right? All right. Let us take first the instance of people like yourselves who will be giving a mantra which is rather long. Now, when you do your seated meditation, and to whatever extent you can, we would advise, if you are open to suggestion, we would suggest to both of you to try to meditate twice a day. Now, it doesn't matter if the evening one is simply a five minute ritual of mantram together, you see, it doesn't matter.

But the beginning and ending of the day, it's important, if you can, to spend some time with the mantram because it will change the whole tenor of your sleep. To give yourself, the two of you together, either seated side by side or on various beds, or even laying down before you're sleeping. Doing the mantram together in a unified way will greatly change your sleep state. It will bring data to you that you both are calling out for.

So this is a suggestion, do with it what you will. But I would say to anyone that, in the night, before going to sleep, it is very important, if you can, to turn your mind to some kind of repetition of some lofty phrase.

As you move off into the sleep state, it will take you to... to more important areas of sleep, you see, because just as you go to various areas of mind during the day, sometimes you're very intense and sometimes you're very light hearted, you see, the same thing is true in the sleep state. There are various areas where there's data that is very important to you that would indeed help you a great deal.

But sometimes it takes greater power to get to those areas, you know. And so one of the great devices is this. So if it appeals to you, please do so. Otherwise of course, do as you... as you feel.

But let us then say the longer mantrams, as you sit down to do the longer mantram, what is necessary with these longer ones is to... if you will be doing them intently with your mind, formulating the words totally, you see, there will come over you literally, like a cloak, there will come over you a feeling, a tone, a quality of tone. And that is what you will dwell on.

The words will then fall away, in a sense. They will just become a mentalization, you see. It's the resounding within you, the reverberation within your body that we would ask that you become. Right. It is a becoming of one with that feeling within you. All right?

Now let us say that we are speaking of someone who doesn't like that, who doesn't have a mantram, who doesn't feel drawn to any other mantrams. To them, I would say there is a mantram within their being that they could respond to if they would give it a chance.

So to those people, I would say get yourself in as quiet a state as you can and ask that you be alerted to what your own sound might be and get yourself very quiet and feel it out. And eventually, in a deeper state of meditation, a feeling will come to you.

And out of that feeling, there is a tone. And experiment with it, you know, verbalize, you know, give voice to it. Just getting in touch with that. Now, I will promise anyone who is hearing this, who really seeks a mantram and who seeks to know their own mantram, if they really seek it, they will find it.

It is a matter of... if they are going out in search of it, it will move toward them. And so if they feel any appeal at all toward what's gone before, I would suggest that they give thought to this. And for those who are beginning and who want to try it, but who have nothing to go on, use any that you hear. You know, we've had this terrible thing. Oh, my. We hear so much. I don't dare pick up a mantram inadvertently, you know, out of a book. You know, we hear this all the time.

And again, I will go, of course, against what many people say. But I would say not to be too concerned with that, that if there is a mantram that you read in a book that appeals to you, use it. If it isn't yours, part of it will drop away, all of it will drop away, or none of it will drop away, and something else will rise to take its place. But none of the mantrams that you work on are going to hurt you in any way.

There's no way that any of the great mantrams... you know, there are many handbooks on mantrams out in the world today that I see no difficulty in finding a mantram. If you are totally adverse to the Indian method, fine, then pick up a phrase. For example, St Francis of Assisi had a mantram that he used which was a constant statement of "My God and my all". This was St. Francis mantram. He used it constantly. "My God and my all." "My God and my all." He just did it over and over and over. And that was the thought that permeated his mind.

So I would say that if that appeals to you, then by all means, use those kinds of things. Whatever appeals to you. That is a phrase that will help you keep your mind centered and begin the transformation, please do so.

If a great sage's name appeals to you, then use that, for example, the name of Ramana. That is a beautiful one. And Ramana will bring on a certain tonal quality, a certain movement within your being. Bhagavan might move you more. It depends. You see... Buddha itself, although rarely do they use that as a mantra.

So on. You see, if... if... if the desire is there, the people will find it. If not, well, then, no blame. We'll just come at them from some other angle. Have I clarified this for you?

Justin Moore:

Yes. One last thing: you said that in... in some cases, the use of... I'm not sure you could call it a mantram because of what... what follows from your observation, but in the case of Hare Krishna, this might have a mesmerizing or hypnotic effect. Would you elaborate on that?

Bartholomew / Mary-Margaret Moore:

Yes. Thank you. Thank you. That's very important to make it slipped from my awareness. I wanted to speak on that. Thank you. All right. What we do not want is a repetition of the mind that goes on and on and on and on and on.

The only time that a mantram is working is when the mind and the heart are both attuned to it. When the mind is thinking it and the heart is feeling it. If there is no feeling in your heart center, then you are not really working with the mantram. You understand that? There must be a reverberation.

Now, you... in the beginning stages, it is usually mental. But transfer your attention from your mind to your heart center. Place your awareness in your heart center, which is, by the way, not where your heart is, but it's in the center of your body. Take the line of your heart on your left and draw a line to the center of your body. And there would be your heart center...

Justin Moore:

... at the bottom of the sternum? Perhaps the breastbone?

Bartholomew / Mary-Margaret Moore:

Yes, that... in that area, right in there. And you can feel it. I mean, it's a large area. When the heart center begins to open, the whole area takes on light. And that becomes a very definite feeling.

Now, in some people, it's even further over to past the center, to the right. Either of those places is valid. See? Either one will do. But in any case, center yourself in that area and do the mantram. Do not do the mantram from your head. Do the mantram from your heart center. When you do it from that center, you will become attuned to the feeling, to the opening that's happening.

You will feel the energies moving and gathering and pulsating throughout your whole body. And soon you will actually feel the whole thing happening in your whole body. It is as if you were... the whole body is... has a timber movement to it. And you'll be resounding to that sound.

No, anything done of the mind, it does very little good. It is a tone, a quality of tone that... that needs to generate throughout the whole aura of your being and that is generated from your heart center. So, do you think I've clarified that?

Justin Moore:

I believe you have, yes.

Bartholomew / Mary-Margaret Moore:

I think, if you don't mind, we'll end this. And... would you send this tape down to our dear friends? I would like to take this time to greet them. I didn't at the beginning of the tape, but I would like to do so now.

And all gratitude and thanks to you for the work that you're doing on our behalf. We are very grateful. We are very much in touch with you. I hope you feel our presence. We have been with you a lot lately and we hope that this is a reciprocal feeling. And all love to you and we look forward to seeing you again.

Justin Moore:

Thank you Bartholomew.

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